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Line 150: ::::[[user:Botushali]], I thought that "refer[ring] to the clan members as a group in plural form" is the clan's "actual name", as it conforms with Psimouli's statement and frequent practice and with Perraivos's list of the names of the Souliot clans. I also thought that Botsarates/Botzarates derives from the suffix -at, as happens in the case of [[Lazarat]], [[Bularat]], [[Filiates]] and so on. Could you please refer to a secondary source verifying your view on the clan's "actual name"? Thanks, [[User:Ashmedai 119|Ashmedai 119]] ([[User talk:Ashmedai 119|talk]]) 07:08, 26 July 2023 (UTC) :::::According to Albanian grammar, the members of Marko's fara are referred to as ''Boçarajt''. ''Boçari'' is used as a surname. The other forms are all hellenized variants adding the endings ''-s'' or ''-oi''. As for the ''Boçari'' clan name, which today is also used in English secondary reliable sources, it is documented in latin script in contemporary primary sources as well, one example is this [https://books.google.com/books?id=MLdIAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA374] dating back to 1822. – [[User:Βατο|Βατο]] ([[User talk:Βατο|talk]]) 12:57, 26 July 2023 (UTC) ::::::[[User:Βατο|Βατο]], thank you for your response. The name of Botsaris himself in Albanian seems to be stated unambiguously in a number of reliable secondary sources (though there are other forms to be found -- I see Yannis Kotsonis including the variants Bozzari and Botzari, but not Boçari) and Maleschreiber was IMHO not in the wrong in adding it in the first sentence of the article's introduction, as I regrettably forgot to do. No such unanimity seems to exist with regards to his fara's name. With my admittedly very limited knowledge of Albanian, I thought that the Albanian version of the fara's name would be Botsarat. Botushali, surely more of a connoisseur of the language than myself, stated it was Boçaret. You [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Markos_Botsaris&diff=prev&oldid=1167220918 added] the form "Boçarajt" to the article along with the form "Boçari". For the first version, you referred the article's readers with the same edit to a book entitled "Arvanitët dhe shqiptarët në luftën çlirimtare të popullit grek" by Dhimiter Grillo. Could you please explain what is the statement included in the book, along with its accompanying textual evidence and the book's reliability? You write "Indiana University" as its publisher. Would that be Indiana University Press? I searched for the book on Google books and I found [https://www.google.com/books/edition/_/fbUVAQAAMAAJ the same title] published in 1985 from [[8 Nëntori Publishing House]] and stating: "Original from:the University of Wisconsin - Madison" (which I assume refers to the digitized item's location). Is this a different book? Thank you in advance. You also referred to the Albanian translation of Psimouli's book, for which I would like to ask you for the full quote as I [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Markos_Botsaris&diff=next&oldid=1167166693 did] earlier, responding to [[user:Nishjan|Nishjan]]. Thanks once more. [[User:Ashmedai 119|Ashmedai 119]] ([[User talk:Ashmedai 119|talk]]) 18:05, 26 July 2023 (UTC) | |||