Talk:Toy Story Mania! - Wikipedia

While we all may enjoy reading JHM and MiceAge/MiceChat for reliable Disney information, because they are blogs they are not considered reliable WP sources. Please try to update the references with non-blog sources, please. SpikeJones 02:08, 1 February 2007 (UTC)Reply

While the press release may say "Toy Story Mania!", there are tons of existing news stories (both mainstream and blog-related) that are using "Toy Story Mania" in the same article that quotes the original press release. Until we see additional communication from Disney emphasizing the "!" portion of the name, let's stay consistent with "Toy Story Mania". If/When we get that confirmation, then this page should be moved to Toy Story Mania! (with a redirect on this page to the new one, of course) SpikeJones 19:20, 1 February 2007 (UTC)Reply

In a Disneyland Resort Press Release dated Janaury 26th, 2007 titled "The Year of a Million Dreams Means New Fun & Adventures at Disneyland Resort", says this about the new ride: Construction has already begun on "Toy Story Mania!"... It is clear that the exclamation point is part of the official name to the attraction. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.168.181.42 (talk • contribs) 15:27, February 1, 2007.

Yes, as I said, I agree about the contents of the press release. It would, however, not be the first time that Disney has put out a press release and then decided later to change the name of an attraction. Considering the mainstream and other press have been using the ride's name without the ! (along with photos taken on Disney property of official Disney signage that show the attraction's name without the ! that have been posted on some blog sites), perhaps we need something additional to go with before making the change part of WP canon. SpikeJones 20:02, 1 February 2007 (UTC)Reply

I am confused, the first part of this discussion says we shouldn't deal with third party sources, such as blogs and newspaper articles, but now we are supposed to ignore the OFFICIAL press release from Disney that clearly says that the ride name's has an "!" Disney says the name has an "!", what is the debate? If they change the name later, so the article gets updated, as of TODAY, the official source has it with an "!". —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.168.181.42 (talk • contribs) 19:42, February 1, 2007.

Consider:

• Disney released two separate press releases that announced this attraction. One was from Disneyland's PR staff and included an exclamation point in the title. The other was from Walt Disney World's PR staff and did not include an exclamation point. Therefore, the evidence is inconclusive until both resorts start communicating in sync. One press release is no more official than the other.
• Also note that both press releases put quotation marks around the title which isn't usually how Disney attractions are expressed.
• Finally, the Walt Disney World release explicitly mentions Buzz Lightyear and the Little Green Men as being part of the attraction, information that was removed from the article because they weren't mentioned in Disneyland's press release.

—Whoville 00:37, 8 February 2007 (UTC)Reply

The signs at Disneyland say "Toy Story Midway Mania!" [1] Bytebear (talk) 04:21, 1 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

The Walt Disney Company, and their official spoke-persons, the Media Relations department call the ride "Toy Story Mania!". All Press Releases and websites call the ride "Toy Story Mania!". It is clear what the ride name is, at least "officially". Yes, the sign at Disney's California Adventure Park does say "Toy Story Midway Mania!", but if the Main division of the company says "Toy Story Mania!" and sends out Press Releases with the name, then that is the name the company is "officially" using. GeorgeKelsey (talk) 05:38, 1 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

Sorry, but you are wrong. The official name is "Toy Story: Midway Mania!" and the sign and all future releases will reflect this. The press releases were shorter so they would emphasize the "Toy Story" aspect of the attraction. The sign on the ride is the difinitive answer, not past press releases. In fact, the press is already calling it simply, "Midway Mania."[2] Even the concept art does not match the final product. Face it, it is "Midway Mania." 208.203.4.140 (talk) 18:24, 8 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

The current official name, based on what the Walt Disney Company says, and shows at places like its official website "ToyStoryMania.com" is Toy Story Mania!. Once the official company spokespersons, press releases and websites use the "alternative" name "Toy Story Midway Mania!", then, and only then, should the page be changed. I think the person who wrote the "disputed" paragraph did a great job in discussing the dispute. GeorgeKelsey (talk) 03:25, 10 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

Question: what makes the attraction's physical sign, that obviously is a permanent installation, any less verifiable? It's there, there are pictures of them both--including this [3] for Florida--so it looks like Bytebear is right. It's now "Toy Story Midway Mania!". --McDoobAU93 (talk) 21:30, 1 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

It's inappropriate to speculate on the reasons why Disney is inconsistent with the attraction's name. These are the facts:

• The attraction was announced to the media in January 2007 as Toy Story Mania![4]
• The first piece of concept art released to the media contains the phrase Toy Story Mania![5]
• The attraction was called Toy Story Mania! during the 2007 Walt Disney World Christmas Day Parade television broadcast.[6]
• Currently, the Disneyland and Walt Disney World resorts consistently describe the attraction as Toy Story Mania! in their respective press releases.[7][8]
• An official mini-site created by Disney is at toystorymania.com. The same site can be accessed at toystorymidwaymania.com so the URL itself is inconclusive.
• However, the logo visible at that URL reads Toy Story Mania! and the phrase appears elsewhere on the page as plain text. The same logo and title are used repeatedly on the disneyland.com and disneyworld.com websites.
• The exterior marquee at Disney's California Adventure clearly reads Toy Story Midway Mania![9] An unconfirmed report says the same phrase is visible on the marquee at Disney's Hollywood Studios.[10]
• The Audio-Animatronic figure of Mr. Potato Head outside the attraction at Disney's California Adventure says Toy Story Midway Mania! during its spiel.[11]
• An audio clip of Mr. Potato Head used in a promotional mailing from Disney's Public Relations staff to members of the media uses Toy Story Midway Mania![12]; note that the same mailing contains the Toy Story Mania! logo seen everywhere else.

Consensus should be reached about which version to consider the attraction's name, and whether the variation should be noted in the first paragraph, like this perhaps:

Toy Story Mania!—also known as Toy Story Midway Mania!—is an interactive theme park attraction under construction at Disney's California Adventure in California and Disney's Hollywood Studios in Florida.

Otherwise all references to the attraction throughout Wikipedia will continue to be changed and reverted by different editors who consider each version the "official" name. —Whoville (talk) 01:24, 30 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

Well put, agreed. We'll refer to your logical reasoning the next time the Bay Lake/Orlando/Lake Buena Vista discussion rears its ugly head. SpikeJones (talk) 03:31, 30 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

Clearly the title has changed at some point. All recent media publications, and permenant installations use "Toy Story: Midway Mania!" Bytebear (talk) 17:42, 30 April 2008 (UTC)Reply

The Disneyland Resort just announced previews of the new attraction this week on its Annual Passholder site, and once again, used the name "Toy Story Mania!" on the page multiple times, and failed to use "Midway" at all. The website, Toy Story Mania! hasn't changed, the current Guide to the Magic DCA map also states "Toy Story Mania!" opening June 17th.

As for the media, here are some recent articles.

• [13]
• [14]

And I also ran a Google search for "Toy Story Midway Mania", and basically found two non-official Disney related Web Sites using "Toy Story Midway Mania!", but the top 4 searches called the ride "Toy Story Mania!", even with Midway as part of the search. It is clear what the Walt Disney Company wants to call the attraction. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.168.181.42 (talk) 06:49, 4 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

The only thing clear to me is that Disney is inconsistent about the name, for reasons that are publicly unknown. Signs at both attraction entrances read Toy Story Midway Mania! but all references in the company's press releases and on its consumer websites continue to use Toy Story Mania! Both are in active use right now. It's premature to simply pick one and declare that clearly it's the only correct name. Disney is using both. For that reason, I'm going to acknowledge the alternate name in the article's first paragraph as I suggested above. I'll defer to future consensus if people feel the article title should be switched to Toy Story Midway Mania! —Whoville (talk) 12:40, 4 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

As an aside, the official WDW map on the WDW website still shows "Disney-MGM Studios". Anyway, there is precedence for Disney using different names for rides at different parks, and for being inconsistent with spelling, punctuation (the tea cups comes to immediate mind, as Disney uses 4 different names for that one). SpikeJones (talk) 15:45, 4 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

A new user Theotherkyle just manually copied over this page and setup a redirect, obviously without checking this discussion. :) I'll do a revert and notify the user. Tiggerjay (talk) 20:46, 14 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

I don't think a consensus has emerged, and given the evidence presented, I think the article name change is appropriate. Bytebear (talk) 22:15, 14 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

It would seem that since there is a lack of consensus, the best thing would be to keep it the way it is, and setup the redirect (done) and wait for something more official, and give Disney the chance to figure out for themselves what is going on. At the very least, wait until the grand opening and check park maps. :) Tiggerjay (talk) 06:30, 15 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

More fuel to the fire: DL is selling merchandise that says "Toy Story Mania!" underneath signs that say "Toy Story Midway Mania". Leads me to believe that both are correct, just going to be different names ala the earlier mentioned tea cup names at different parks. So we can keep the article named as is. SpikeJones (talk) 12:58, 16 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

Here appears to be the answer from Paul Berry, as heard on Inside the Magic podcast, show 162 -- I know, totally NN nor RS, however, according to him, Disney press indicates that there really are two names -- the long name (TSMM) is the in-park name, however the marketing department argued that it was too long, so for all outside-park advertisement, it's shortened to (TSM). Oi! I hope that isn't the real reason, as that's simply a crazy reason. And if that is the case, we will not have an answer after the attraction officially opens. Oh well. Tiggerjay (talk) 05:16, 18 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

There won't be an answer until someone credible from Disney explains the use of both names in a reliable source. Anything else is just speculation based on observing the names in different contexts—like the long list above—and wondering why one was used versus the other. —Whoville (talk) 14:16, 18 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

just got a piece of promo material from disney today, calling it "toy story mania!". I think the article deals with the name issue (signage vs promotional) appropriately as it is currently written. SpikeJones (talk) 14:22, 21 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

Look at this:

This is from the most recent DHS guidemap. The official name of the attraction is Toy Story Midway Mania!. By the way, in case this hasn't been settled, I've seen the Pixar Place part on the website where I found the description of the ride. Pixar Place is shaded in green, and all oof the attractions in Mickey Avenue are shaded in green, so Mickey Avenue is indeed being renamed to Pixar Place. 24.151.137.19 (talk) 21:32, 23 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

It seems that within the parks it is "Midway," but in promotional and press related material it is not. Probably because they don't want people to feel bogged down with the long name. The question is, will it come to be known as "Midway Mania" or "Toy Story Mania?" My bet is on the latter. Time will tell. Bytebear (talk) 21:57, 23 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

this issue can be found at: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Disney#Attraction Naming Standards - please feel free to chime in over there. Tiggerjay (talk) 06:36, 3 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

I feel it is important to note that the attraction was know about nearly a full year before it was announced. Right now the article reads as if it was designed for WDW, when the opposite is true. Discussion of the attraction being built for WDW did not occur until long before it was know to be going to Disneyland. This should be noted in the article. Al Luts did an article on it, and he is is a reliable source, even if a message board is the only reference I can find to his article. Bytebear (talk) 03:50, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

I strongly disagree. Lutz runs a self-published website that relies entirely upon anonymous sources for his reports. His articles are inherently unreliable sources according to established, agreed-upon Wikipedia standards. His predictions and claims may turn out to be true much of the time but his website does not adhere to Wikipedia standards for verifiability. For perspective, consider that the Al Lutz article contains numerous examples of situations where Lutz wrote that something occurred only to have someone else deny it and there's no determination of which side is telling the truth. Furthermore, I don't think Wikipedia articles ought to begin following the online fandom trend of tracking every construction rumor and the internal politics of which executives are liked or disliked. —Whoville (talk) 10:52, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

Ditto what Whoville said. Many of us know about various rumors and planned projects for Disney and elsewhere outside of MA, JHM, SC, AICN, and other sites that fight to be the ones to say "first!". We just don't talk about what we know until they're officially announced and can be properly sourced per WP policy. SpikeJones (talk) 12:39, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

At the same time, the original user has a point. The development of a Disney attraction is not an instant process. Knowing its full development history is notable, and the stories behind many attractions, such as the Haunted Mansion and Space Mountain are near-legendary, and well-documented with interviews with Imagineers, management staff, etc. That being said, if we had a more verifiable source for this statement, instead of a blogger, it should be part of the article. Until that time, I completely agree with Spike and Whoville. --McDoobAU93 (talk) 17:31, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

[15], [16]. The articles don't explicitly state the timeline for the decision to build at both parks, but they do make it clear that the attraction was originally conceptualized in its current location at Paradise Pier in DCA. FishSpeaker (talk) 00:09, 15 July 2008 (UTC)Reply

You're correct Fish -- this article doesn't address *any* of the history behind the ride creation, so any commentary here about the article being written from a WDW-perspective can only be taken by the fact that WDW is mentioned first...and this was because the WDW version opened first. If you would like to paraphrase/summarize and cite the TftLP and CNN articles in a new "history of the ride" section, that is where you address that the ride was created for CA and tacked into FL secondarily. SpikeJones (talk) 01:36, 15 July 2008 (UTC)Reply

Now that the Nintendo Wii game has been introduced, and currently at the Disneyland Resort, the Tram Loading area is still using "Toy Story Mania!" as the logo and name for the attraction, can we all agree that the "Official" name used by the Walt Disney Company is JUST "Toy Story Mania!", and that the "Midway" shows up once you enter the turnstiles, and is a secondary name. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.90.66.111 (talk) 21:39, 3 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Let me add, I just edited the main page, and EVERY reference used on the main page also calls the attraction "Toy Story Mania!", it is clear what the "official" name is.